Can anybody says John was replaced?

[mciiii]

I'm think no.


From "How i won the war" (1967)

1980 photo sesion

[lili]

I tend to agree with you on this. John was not replaced

[plastic paul]

Yes we all know John wasn't replaced.

Whether or not he had a "stage double" if you will, is what is really up for contention, based on the point i believe you were making!

[JoJo]

plasticpaul said:

Yes we all know John wasn't replaced.

Whether or not he had a "stage double" if you will, is what is really up for contention, based on the point i believe you were making!

It was suggested these photos with an alleged double were used in the absence of the genuine article for whatever reason. From the Redferns.com site:

ABOUT REDFERNS MUSIC PICTURE LIBRARY

The library was created by photographer David Redfern in the early 1960s when he photographed premier British Pop Shows like Ready Steady Go and Thank Your Lucky Stars, resulting in classic shots of the Beatles and Rolling Stones amongst many others. Nights were spent at the 100 Club, Ronnie Scott’s or the Marquee, where he captured on film all the Jazz greats from Duke Ellington to Miles Davis. Realising that to break into the commercial world he had to chase the important American names, David became a regular visitor to the Jazz and Rock Festivals in the States, as well as Europe, photographing such legends as Bob Dylan and Jimi Hendrix.

These pictures were to contribute to what is now one of the world’s leading suppliers of music and music-related imagery, covering every aspect of music from late 18th century composers to the current charts.

Over 18,000 different artists and groups are stored in our database, embracing every music genre: Rock & Pop, Jazz & Blues, Soul & RnB, Gospel, Latin, Country, Heavy Metal, World, Punk, Folk, Cajun & Zydeco, M.O.R, Disco, Classical, Opera – and any other style you can think of! Other music related subjects include Music Instruments from around the world, Recording Studios and Technical Equipment, Dance and Ballet, Historic Events and Venues.

We also have an expansive miscellaneous section which includes pictures of Concerts, Crowds, Stage Lighting and Atmospherics across all music styles and fashions which are of great appeal to advertising and design clients.

Whatever music imagery you are sourcing - remember Redferns.

THE ONE STOP MUSIC PICTURE SHOP!

Now, the price of a print from this place is often $500 for starters. (rough guestimate, all prices are in pounds) Doesn't it seem like an upscale seller like this would have some serious safeguards in place? Yeah, there are post 1966 pics of Paul McCartney for sale as such, but that's a separate issue..

If one single photo for sale was deemed a picture of a double, his business would be toast.

[LOVELYRITA]

John may have had a double for the days of touring and they had doubles to get into limos and other vehicles as a decoy to throw the madness of fans. John may have had a double for his film work, but he was not replaced as Bill replaced Paul.

While he aged, he lost weight and his features seem more sculpted, the teeth match and the nose is the same. That's the same man.

[TotalInformation]

If one single photo for sale was deemed a picture of a double, his business would be toast.

Only if he were found to be engaged in a pre-meditated deliberate deception. Redfern couldn't be held liable for taking a picture of a public figure at an official or semi-official event if it later turned out the "public figure" was a stand-in sent to the event by said public figure with no notice to the press or anyone else.

[JoJo]

Redfern's pictures contribute to the collection, they are hardly the sum total. (as stated on his site) Judging by the sheer number, (visit his site if you wish) it seems likely he must rely (and fact check) on other sources.

I'm coming down with the sniffles Olivia, ring up my double would you? Are we to believe George for example had such a cynical attitude?

[TotalInformation]

I'm coming down with the sniffles Olivia, ring up my double would you? Are we to believe George for example had such a cynical attitude?

Well, I'm not really invested in the question much either way, but I did find a couple of the pics in question a bit off. Sniffles is one thing, a death threat about shwoing up somewhere is another. (Or maybe a secret Klaatu recording session?)

[JoJo]

Death threats? Well now you done gone and made it impossible to respond.. Some might find that a wild scenario. Putting in a double in a photo session would only serve one purpose, (playing devil's advocate for a moment) and that would be to tell people we can do it anytime we wish, and not just with Paul.

Is taking that big a risk a PTB/Illuminati M.O. though?

I like the idea of being away for a Klaatu recording session.

[DarkHorse]

mciiii said:

The question with this pic is whether or not John is wearing a sarcastic grin or if he really he is that sad in the pic. If the sad look is real, then it is likely he began filming "How I Won the War" in late September of '66 as a way to distract himself from the pain of Paul's death. Obviously, a true sad look as this indicates something was up. This disputes some of the Beatle timeline books that say he was in Spain making this film around the first week of September. It doesn't make sense that the reason for stopping touring was any other reason than for the tragedy of Paul's death. So I think the Beatle timeline books are "fudged" to cover up this September 11-12th period.

[DarkHorse]

JoJo and Total, George did receive death threats throughout his career. However, I don't see George sending a double out there and risking the double's life too. It doesn't fit his character for George to do this.

The purpose of Paul's double was to continue the Beatles success, i.e. make more money, etc., not to protect Paul, obviously, who was already dead imo. Not that I don't think a double could be used for protection, it's just that it doesn't fit in the scenario.

[mciiii]

Well, nobody can say John was replaced, and now, can anybody says Paul was replaced?


1963 pic


1967 pic

Yes is the answer and you know that for sure J.L. 1973

[lili]

I agree with Darkhorse.

[LOVELYRITA]

mciiii said:

Well, nobody can say John was replaced, and now, can anybody says Paul was replaced?


1963 pic


1967 pic

Yes is the answer and you know that for sure J.L. 1973

No doubt this was a replacement. The top pic is the real JPM, which is more difficult to comprehend because it's been so long, I've said this before.
The second pic is Bill, the chicklet man, although at this time, he looks the most like JPM than he ever did or will.

[TotalInformation]

there are several reasons why a double might be employed beyond the situation with FAUL/JPM

A) When someone has to be two places at once. EG: CLinton/Blair doubles at a pub photo-op in Scotland while they were really at Bildergerg.

B) Security - the situation I emntioned previously. the double wouldn't be a bum off the street, but a wellpaid operative aware of the risks. ths would proabaly be accompanied by other security measures.

c) to make an artistic point, as the Beatles were when George had Keith Richards sat in for him in the butcher cover



d) not applicable to GH at any stage -- when handlers have incapacitated the public figure and installed a willing stooge to run things their way. EG: Pope Paul VI

[LOVELYRITA]

Keith Richards replacing George? Who was on drugs at that time?

[lili]

Not to be contrary, but I'm not convinced that it isn't George on that cover. They all looked burned out that day.

[TotalInformation]

Well, he is on that partcular cover, isn't he?

They all looked burned out that day.

Yet only one looks like Keith Richards.

[lili]

I have to really think about that, Total.

[LOVELYRITA]

If there ever was a Keith replacing George Harrison, look on the back of the Revolver Cover, and you see man with shades on. Supposed to be George, but I had always suspected something strange in this one. Even before the PID theories.
That does not look like George.
However, the Butcher cover still looks like George.

here's a link to a pic of the Stones in 1960's

www.famousfriends.co.uk/picture/326/

[TotalInformation]

If there ever was a Keith replacing George Harrison, look on the back of the Revolver Cover, and you see man with shades on. Supposed to be George, but I had always suspected something strange in this one. Even before the PID theories.
That does not look like George.
However, the Butcher cover still looks like George. Even before his dental work, George had better teeth than Keith Richards.

The photo on the back of Revolver would have been taken at around the same time they were playing these games.

The teeth on "George" on the back-Revolver photo are no more or less degenerate than the ones in the butcher cover.

PS - Note it's not a matter of "replacement."

[JoJo]

The theory is that they would be playing a game of replacing someone quite familiar with perhaps the idea of later revealing that indeed, the viewer can be fooled. Was that what they had cooking in late '65, early '66? Good question. If memory serves, someone commented somewhere that many remarked that Keith strongly resembled George at the time. (not later on of course)

Here's one pic of Keith that I posted elsewhere in the forum: (mag published in 1966)

[lili]

Keith:

"Supposed " Keith as George:

Now the "real" George:




I have to say after looking this over carefully, that if this is all the proof that we have I cannot concur.
It looks to me like Keith is Keith & George is George

[LOVELYRITA]

It's hard to believe that was Keith Richards....as we know him as Iguana man now. He looks like a lizard.
Maybe the "creature" we think of as Keith Richards is really the Creature from the Black Lagoon.

I wished I could see the Keith/Feorge thing on butcher, but I can't.

Has anyone ever done a side by side of the original Keith Richards and Iguana Man Fichards?

[revolver]

I thinks it's George. The characteristic tuft of hair on top of his head looks the same. It's probably the facial expression that gives him a passing resemblance to Richards.