Beatles were Christian Band

[B]

Thanks to Tafultong for this link:

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/2298584/'Bigger-than-Jesus-The-Beatles-were-a-Christian-band'.html

'Bigger than Jesus? The Beatles were a Christian band'
"By Jonathan Wynne-Jones, Religious Affairs Correspondent
Last Updated: 5:09PM BST 13/07/2008

John Lennon famously claimed the Beatles were more popular than Jesus, even predicting that Christianity would "vanish and shrink".

But 28 years after his death, in an interview being broadcast for the first time, he claims that on the contrary, he hoped to encourage people to focus on the Christian faith.

Despite his familiar image as a hippy icon who invited us to imagine a world without religion, Lennon says he was "one of Christ's biggest fans" and felt emotional in church.

In the interview, which was recorded in 1969 and is being aired on BBC Radio 4's Sunday programme, he talks about the Church of England, his vision of heaven, and expresses disappointment at not being allowed to marry his second wife, Yoko Ono, in church.

The interview was conducted by Ken Seymour of the Canadian Broadcasting Corporation when Lennon and Ono were at the Bed-In for Peace protest in Montreal. It was bought three years ago by National Museums Liverpool, which is playing an extract at a new exhibition at World Museum Liverpool.

Christians around the world had been dismayed by Lennon's boast in an article in London's Evening Standard about the popularity of the Beatles, but the singer says he was misunderstood.

"It's just an expression meaning the Beatles seem to me to have more influence over youth than Christ," he says. "Now I wasn't saying that was a good idea, 'cos I'm one of Christ's biggest fans. And if I can turn the focus on the Beatles on to Christ's message, then that's what we're here to do."

He blames "the hypocrites" for being too "uptight" in reacting to his comments. "If the Beatles get on the side of Christ, which they always were, and let people know that, then maybe the churches won't be full, but there'll be a lot of Christians dancing in the dance halls. Whatever they celebrate, God and Christ, I don't think it matters as long as they're aware of Him and His message."

He acknowledges a strong belief in the power of prayer but says he dislikes all the church trappings. "Community praying is probably very powerful… I'm just against the hypocrisy and the hat-wearing and the socialising and the tea parties."

His aversion to institutional religion was shaped when a "ludicrous" vicar banned him from a church when he was 14 because he and his friends were "having the giggles".

"I wasn't convinced of the vicar's sincerity anyway. But I knew it was the house of God. So I went along for that and the atmosphere always made me feel emotional and religious or whatever you call it.

"Being thrown out of church for laughing was the end of the Church for me."

He continues: "I would have liked to have been married in a church but they wouldn't marry divorcees… That's pure hypocrisy." The Church's position on the issue changed in 2002.

On heaven, he says: "I haven't got any sort of dream of a physical heaven where there's lots of chocolate and pretty women in nightgowns, playing harps. I believe you can make heaven within your own mind. The kingdom of heaven is within you, Christ said, and I believe that."

The author Paul Du Noyer, who has written extensively on the Beatles, said: "He was chastened by the reaction he got to his Jesus remarks and it probably made him think more carefully about religion.

"These comments would have been a great boost for churches if they had come out at the time." "

[mommybird]

Fascinating, Letter B ! This really jars with the concept of John & Yoko being occultists.
Although I have to say that it will take alot more than this article to convince me otherwise about HER.

[Jacobthelema]

I've considered being a Christian,

But only on a very humanistic scale.

[brotherdave]

Jul 14, 2008 2:54:23 GMT -5 @mommybird said:

Fascinating, Letter B ! This really jars with the concept of John & Yoko being occultists.
Although I have to say that it will take alot more than this article to convince me otherwise about HER.

John was a Christian then wasn't then was then...>

;D

[tafultong]

Jul 14, 2008 20:59:03 GMT -5 @brotherdave said:

Jul 14, 2008 2:54:23 GMT -5 @mommybird said:

Fascinating, Letter B ! This really jars with the concept of John & Yoko being occultists.
Although I have to say that it will take alot more than this article to convince me otherwise about HER.

John was a Christian then wasn't then was then...>

;D

"Don't you know that you can count me out....in"

[LOVELYRITA]

The only inclination to anything "spiritual" or "religious" was George and that was Eastern beliefs, like Indian and Tibetan perhaps.

There was nothing in their music or their personal lives that gave me any inclination they were Christian. They only time the word "Christ" was mentioned in any lyrics, was not in worship, but in "Ballad of John and Yoko" and that was not in reference to beliefs.

I had read that John dabbled with Christianity for a brief period in the 1970's, but John and Yoko were experimenting with other religious practices and I've heard they were also taking part in occult things. When I have time, I will have to try to find the references to that.

Being a "Christian" band would mean they all would have to have been Christian and their music would have had some Christian meanings. Beatles were never about that.

I'm skeptical, how do we know that the "voice" in the interview was really Lennon or an imposter?

[eyesbleed]

Jul 17, 2008 8:37:22 GMT -5 LOVELYRITA said:

The only inclination to anything "spiritual" or "religious" was George and that was Eastern beliefs, like Indian and Tibetan perhaps.

There was nothing in their music or their personal lives that gave me any inclination they were Christian. They only time the word "Christ" was mentioned in any lyrics, was not in worship, but in "Ballad of John and Yoko" and that was not in reference to beliefs.

I had read that John dabbled with Christianity for a brief period in the 1970's, but John and Yoko were experimenting with other religious practices and I've heard they were also taking part in occult things. When I have time, I will have to try to find the references to that.

Being a "Christian" band would mean they all would have to have been Christian and their music would have had some Christian meanings. Beatles were never about that.

I'm skeptical, how do we know that the "voice" in the interview was really Lennon or an imposter?

Ditto.... I agree with everything LR sez.
I'm extra sensitive to "christian rock"....
it instantly makes me wanna puke.
But thru all these decades I've never once felt the slightest upchuck while enjoying The Beatles music. ;D
So my meter sez NO WAY.

John (if it really was John) was probably just throwing some crazy crap out there to see what would happen.

[DarkHorse]

Jul 18, 2008 7:20:20 GMT -5 eyesbleed said:

I'm extra sensitive to "christian rock"....
it instantly makes me wanna puke.

Me too.

[Jai Guru Deva]

Some of the Christian bands coming out of the "Jesus Movement" era of the early 70's were really great. Of course, if you don't agree with the lyrics, then it probably doesn't matter how good they're playing.

Billy Preston sang some Christian songs, "That's The Way God Planned It" is probably the best known.

That's The Way God Planned It

For a brief time, Steve Winwood, Eric Clapton, Ric Grech, and Ginger Baker formed a group called Blind Faith and they sang a song called Presence Of The Lord

Anyway, back to John Lennon and the Beatles. "Let It Be" probably feels the closest to a Christian song, then there are some other songs with religious overtones. Alf Bicknell--the Beatles chauffeur, told a story about how the Beatles would record themselves in the back seat singing gospel songs and reading from the Bible (Beatlemania era). John Lennon also went through a born-again phase in the early 70's, then Yoko turned him right back around.

www.christianitytoday.com/ct/article_print.html?id=39891

[eyesbleed]

Jul 18, 2008 13:44:35 GMT -5 Jai Guru Deva said:

Some of the Christian bands coming out of the "Jesus Movement" era of the early 70's were really great. Of course, if you don't agree with the lyrics, then it probably doesn't matter how good they're playing.

Billy Preston sang some Christian songs, "That's The Way God Planned It" is probably the best known.

That's The Way God Planned It

For a brief time, Steve Winwood, Eric Clapton, Ric Grech, and Ginger Baker formed a group called Blind Faith and they sang a song called Presence Of The Lord

Anyway, back to John Lennon and the Beatles. "Let It Be" probably feels the closest to a Christian song, then there are some other songs with religious overtones. Alf Bicknell--the Beatles chauffeur, told a story about how the Beatles would record themselves in the back seat singing gospel songs and reading from the Bible (Beatlemania era). John Lennon also went through a born-again phase in the early 70's, then Yoko turning him right back around.

www.christianitytoday.com/ct/article_print.html?id=39891

Well sure, I agree.
And Blind Faith is an excellent classic rock album... one of my favorites. Every song is great.
I've got plenty of music by various artists who sing about god or spirituality in one way or another. That's not really what I was referring to. All the up-chuck-inducing "Christian rock" uses certain lingo... or code words if you prefer.
This lingo is in the lyrics of every single song, regardless of the genre of the music itself.
It's one thing to sing about god but another to deliberately use this specific lingo in order to sell cd's to the "Christian youth" set.

[Doc]

Jul 18, 2008 16:27:48 GMT -5 eyesbleed said:

Jul 18, 2008 13:44:35 GMT -5 Jai Guru Deva said:

Some of the Christian bands coming out of the "Jesus Movement" era of the early 70's were really great. Of course, if you don't agree with the lyrics, then it probably doesn't matter how good they're playing.

Billy Preston sang some Christian songs, "That's The Way God Planned It" is probably the best known.

That's The Way God Planned It

For a brief time, Steve Winwood, Eric Clapton, Ric Grech, and Ginger Baker formed a group called Blind Faith and they sang a song called Presence Of The Lord

Anyway, back to John Lennon and the Beatles. "Let It Be" probably feels the closest to a Christian song, then there are some other songs with religious overtones. Alf Bicknell--the Beatles chauffeur, told a story about how the Beatles would record themselves in the back seat singing gospel songs and reading from the Bible (Beatlemania era). John Lennon also went through a born-again phase in the early 70's, then Yoko turning him right back around.

www.christianitytoday.com/ct/article_print.html?id=39891

Well sure, I agree.
And Blind Faith is an excellent classic rock album... one of my favorites. Every song is great.
I've got plenty of music by various artists who sing about god or spirituality in one way or another. That's not really what I was referring to. All the up-chuck-inducing "Christian rock" uses certain lingo... or code words if you prefer.
This lingo is in the lyrics of every single song, regardless of the genre of the music itself.
It's one thing to sing about god but another to deliberately use this specific lingo in order to sell cd's to the "Christian youth" set.

Amen, eyes.

Crazy me; I actually think that God, or His Spirit, uses whatever music is at hand to reach whomever when He chooses to.
The most seemingly secular song in the world might speak volumes to one person.

But in this age everyone is not religious, per se, or Christian, and at a future time, when God exposits Himself and His son, i.e. when the "apocalypse" or the "pulling of the drape in order to reveal all things" happens, then all the people will be hip to all the things that
it is their destiny to be hip to. I see it as incremental and done in ages, or blocks of time, periods, or, "for however" longs, definite but finite terms of execution, which is really what I think most incidences of the term "for ever" in scripture means. For ever in dozens of cases in the Bible refers only to things things that can be true only so long as the people involved are alive, or the conditions exist. It is a term, a sentence, an age, a space, whatever. Well, IMHO.

For those with less and far less and even no religious leanings (which is fine)--this may be looked at in this way:

There is more coming down the pike.
When it happens to you, you will know it.
Then you will have a modified situation to live and learn in.

Unless you don't.

But I think we will.

Ancient, tedious complexities in scripture will suddenly make sense. Our purpose and existence will be better understood.The process of our coming about on planet Earth will
be better grasped. Ancient grudges will be smoothed away; old debts will begin to be repaid, old hurts will be redressed, confusion will be clarified, justice will be issued,
love will be requited, and, at long last, "Phantom of the Opera" will close on Broadway.
Because it surely seems to be running FOREVER, which is a long but finite interval, and when it goes, then perhaps will come something like the end of the world.

But I have not been able to achieve appreciation of much Christian rock; maybe it's my fault; who knows, maybe the artists are musically gifted but the intent and sound of it just hasn't captured me yet. Plain old Gospel music of all styles seems to work just fine for me.

Religion? Well, many men (and women) would like to see themselves as a created being, fashioned from the hand of a Creator, somewhere, with power and wisdom, greater than our own.

We would like to think that there is a Father, a Celestial Poppa, and perhaps Momma, in Outer Space somewhere, watching us.

We hope he is capable of all things through miraculous means.

We want Him (Her, It) to take care of our "souls", if we have such a thing, when we die, for we know we will. We want protection and care.

We want love. We want guidance.

We want the answers to ALLLLLL of our questions.

We want restitution. We want forgiveness. We want assurance.

As we grow up, and old, most of us find a lot of that in ourselves. And a lot of that is IN ourselves.

And it works well for a long time.

Then one day, we think, hmm, there must be something more. Something else.
Is it God? Is He there? Why is He hiding Himself? Will we ever know him one on one?

So, we know that we all have yearnings and needs that seek ultimate fulfillment.

But--back to the music. If we are privately convinced that there is a God, and He is out there somewhere, and we want to share that belief with others, and we are able to do it thru music------then where does the cost/profit ratio fit in? You can't just give the music away if it's one's means of support, and if it cost so many thousands of $$$$ to produce professionally. How commercial do I have to make to, to guarantee that it sells enough "units" to guarantee my world goes on? And my recording contract? Is my music, mine? Or God's? Or the record companies? Where is the split? Is God on the Board of directors?
Does God "get a take"? Can my need for money mess up the message?

Not to get into denominational issues; controversies, and contractual obligations.

So, you see, Religious Music is up against it. No pun intended. Good thing the Beatles never felt that way. They did it as they wished from Day One and never had to make EMI happy.

Did I just write that?

So we see how it is. There are universal "pressures" in the mainstream, commercial music industry, that stifle the "spirit" in the music sometimes, secular and sacred.

I am fascinated to learn that Winwood and Clapton, Baker and Gretch collaborated on such a song as that. I have not listened to it yet. We do not know that God WASN'T in the studio with them that day........

"A double minded man is unstable in all his ways......" I think that is in corinthians somewhere.

thebookofjames.wordpress.com/2006/08/18/18-he-is-a-double-minded-man-unstable-in-all-his-ways/

bible.cc/james/1-8.htm

Hmm. There may be a little of me in all that. Sigh.

I adored John Lennon and still do, may he rest in peace.

But he was a little double minded. Maybe that has a bit to do with the title "Double Fantasy" and less about replacements........

"Give Peace a chance." -------John. The Beatle.

"Blessed are the peacemakers, for the shall be called the children of God." ---Matthew. The Beatitudes.

[FAUllibLE]

Jul 18, 2008 7:20:20 GMT -5 eyesbleed said:

Jul 17, 2008 8:37:22 GMT -5 LOVELYRITA said:

The only inclination to anything "spiritual" or "religious" was George and that was Eastern beliefs, like Indian and Tibetan perhaps.

There was nothing in their music or their personal lives that gave me any inclination they were Christian. They only time the word "Christ" was mentioned in any lyrics, was not in worship, but in "Ballad of John and Yoko" and that was not in reference to beliefs.

I had read that John dabbled with Christianity for a brief period in the 1970's, but John and Yoko were experimenting with other religious practices and I've heard they were also taking part in occult things. When I have time, I will have to try to find the references to that.

Being a "Christian" band would mean they all would have to have been Christian and their music would have had some Christian meanings. Beatles were never about that.

I'm skeptical, how do we know that the "voice" in the interview was really Lennon or an imposter?

Ditto.... I agree with everything LR sez.
I'm extra sensitive to "christian rock"....
it instantly makes me wanna puke.
But thru all these decades I've never once felt the slightest upchuck while enjoying The Beatles music. ;D
So my meter sez NO WAY.

John (if it really was John) was probably just throwing some crazy crap out there to see what would happen.

I'm with you eyes, theres nothing Christian about rock.

[eyesbleed]

Jul 19, 2008 3:11:11 GMT -5 Doc said:

Amen, eyes.

Crazy me; I actually think that God, or His Spirit, uses whatever music is at hand to reach whomever when He chooses to.
The most seemingly secular song in the world might speak volumes to one person.

But in this age everyone is not religious, per se, or Christian, and at a future time, when God exposits Himself and His son, i.e. when the "apocalypse" or the "pulling of the drape in order to reveal all things" happens, then all the people will be hip to all the things that
it is their destiny to be hip to. I see it as incremental and done in ages, or blocks of time, periods, or, "for however" longs, definite but finite terms of execution, which is really what I think most incidences of the term "for ever" in scripture means. For ever in dozens of cases in the Bible refers only to things things that can be true only so long as the people involved are alive, or the conditions exist. It is a term, a sentence, an age, a space, whatever. Well, IMHO.

For those with less and far less and even no religious leanings (which is fine)--this may be looked at in this way:

There is more coming down the pike.
When it happens to you, you will know it.
Then you will have a modified situation to live and learn in.

Unless you don't.

But I think we will.

Ancient, tedious complexities in scripture will suddenly make sense. Our purpose and existence will be better understood.The process of our coming about on planet Earth will
be better grasped. Ancient grudges will be smoothed away; old debts will begin to be repaid, old hurts will be redressed, confusion will be clarified, justice will be issued,
love will be requited, and, at long last, "Phantom of the Opera" will close on Broadway.
Because it surely seems to be running FOREVER, which is a long but finite interval, and when it goes, then perhaps will come something like the end of the world.

But I have not been able to achieve appreciation of much Christian rock; maybe it's my fault; who knows, maybe the artists are musically gifted but the intent and sound of it just hasn't captured me yet. Plain old Gospel music of all styles seems to work just fine for me.

Religion? Well, many men (and women) would like to see themselves as a created being, fashioned from the hand of a Creator, somewhere, with power and wisdom, greater than our own.

We would like to think that there is a Father, a Celestial Poppa, and perhaps Momma, in Outer Space somewhere, watching us.

We hope he is capable of all things through miraculous means.

We want Him (Her, It) to take care of our "souls", if we have such a thing, when we die, for we know we will. We want protection and care.

We want love. We want guidance.

We want the answers to ALLLLLL of our questions.

We want restitution. We want forgiveness. We want assurance.

As we grow up, and old, most of us find a lot of that in ourselves. And a lot of that is IN ourselves.

And it works well for a long time.

Then one day, we think, hmm, there must be something more. Something else.
Is it God? Is He there? Why is He hiding Himself? Will we ever know him one on one?

So, we know that we all have yearnings and needs that seek ultimate fulfillment.

But--back to the music. If we are privately convinced that there is a God, and He is out there somewhere, and we want to share that belief with others, and we are able to do it thru music------then where does the cost/profit ratio fit in? You can't just give the music away if it's one's means of support, and if it cost so many thousands of $$$$ to produce professionally. How commercial do I have to make to, to guarantee that it sells enough "units" to guarantee my world goes on? And my recording contract? Is my music, mine? Or God's? Or the record companies? Where is the split? Is God on the Board of directors?
Does God "get a take"? Can my need for money mess up the message?

Not to get into denominational issues; controversies, and contractual obligations.

So, you see, Religious Music is up against it. No pun intended. Good thing the Beatles never felt that way. They did it as they wished from Day One and never had to make EMI happy.

Did I just write that?

So we see how it is. There are universal "pressures" in the mainstream, commercial music industry, that stifle the "spirit" in the music sometimes, secular and sacred.

I am fascinated to learn that Winwood and Clapton, Baker and Gretch collaborated on such a song as that. I have not listened to it yet. We do not know that God WASN'T in the studio with them that day........

"A double minded man is unstable in all his ways......" I think that is in corinthians somewhere.

thebookofjames.wordpress.com/2006/08/18/18-he-is-a-double-minded-man-unstable-in-all-his-ways/

bible.cc/james/1-8.htm

Hmm. There may be a little of me in all that. Sigh.

I adored John Lennon and still do, may he rest in peace.

But he was a little double minded. Maybe that has a bit to do with the title "Double Fantasy" and less about replacements........

"Give Peace a chance." -------John. The Beatle.

"Blessed are the peacemakers, for the shall be called the children of God." ---Matthew. The Beatitudes.

Holy Moly... what a post!
Well... I can't add anything to THAT!
You probably needed to rest up after that one! ;D


And yes, I highly recommend the Blind Faith cd. It's probably in my top 10 fave "classic rock" cd's list. I think you would really enjoy it also.
I see there's a remastered reissue of Blind Faith, so I'm gonna have to buy it again...... if ya haven't picked up a copy by then, I could send ya my old one.
There is also a Blind Faith Live in Hyde Park 1969 DVD which I would also highly recommend.