Did Faul write and compose his songs?

[mommybird]

Jude wrote:
There is no conspiracy to get talented individuals to write material for Bill to sing and perform. What he writes and sings is what he sings and writes, otherwise he would've fared much better throughout his solo career thus far, wouldn't he? You only believe the way you do because your philosophy seems to be to "hate first, find factual evidence to support my claims later facts are completely inconsequential.

It has been insinuated by others in the music industry that Faul has collaborated with people & not given them credit for their work.
Either Faul's songwriting abilities have greatly improved over the years, or he is doing just that. His last few albums seem to be of a much higher calliber.

[Jude]

I know of at least two people on this forum that would respectfully disagree with you about his last few albums being any better. JoJo and I happen to be big RAM fans. The first album isn't that bad, either.

And what do you mean by "insinuated by others in music industry"? Other Beatles had plagiarized material and/or collaborated with others while not giving credit (George Harrison and John Lennon come to mind). I just don't get why there's this need to think that since Paul McCartney died and was replaced by a look-alike, that the look-alike couldn't be a great songwriter as well. You can't always put an explanation behind talent; if other songwriters could so easily write Hey Jude, Get Back, and Let It Be within the same year (1968), why in the world wouldn't they want to make it big themselves instead of hiding in the shadow of the Beatles?

[mommybird]

Jude, I'm not so sure who wrote those songs. I'm pretty sure that Paul was working on Get Back when he died. I'm not too sure if Bill had any imput on Hey Jude & Let it Be. I guess I should research & see if I can find that out. Unfortunately, I'm outta time here right now.
I happen to agree with you about RAM. I also liked Band on the Run. McCartney was kinda cute. I was very impressed when I read that he played all the instruments on that himself.
I'm only stating what I have read. I wish I could remember where I read it.

[TotalInformation]

Surely, sugar daddy is only meant in a metaphorical sense vis-a-vis songwriting credit/artistic/business sense?

Again, look to Elton on Let It Be. This topic has been covered on many other threads -- Yoko, Laine, Mike Love, Ray Davies, Elvis Costello, George Martin, etc etc etc.

Of the last three PAUL MCCARTNEY albums, Nigel Godrich's was by far the best musicianship. The other two, by Sir Faul, are dreadful, but at least Driving Rain had the merit of being revealing...

[Jude]

Something tells me you have no idea what you're talking about.

Let It Be was written and performed in 1968.

Elton John was no doubt a starving artist performing in clubs in 1968, as he didn't even release his debut album until summer of the next year. George Martin writing Beatles songs? I'll give you that possibility, but remember that he's a classically trained musician; classically trained musicians usually don't write great rock/pop songs.

[DarkHorse]

totalinformation said:

Maybe I'm Amazed's melody was clearly composed by Elton, but the lyrics are pretty clearly from written by Faul to Linda and pertain to their unique situation.

This rings true for me.


Regarding the writing of Faul's songs by other musicians, well nobody really knows for sure. That is why we are here. There's no use getting upset because someone is saying Faul didn't write his own songs. If it is possible that he is not the real Paul, then it is certainly possible that he didn't write some/all of his own songs.

[Jude]

Well, yeah. But the same could be said for the other Beatles, right? For example, not many people know that Elton John wrote most of "Whatever Gets You Through The Night", a classic John Lennon solo song.

And oftentimes the Beatles, especially John, were total plagiarists. For instance, "Happy Xmas (War Is Over)" is a direct rip off of the classic folk song "Stewball". And let's not even get started on the "Yesterday" debate--there are WAY too many songs linked to that one and I doubt we'll ever know if McCartney really wrote it himself.

[mommybird]

Wow, I had no idea that Elton wrote "Whatever gets you through the night ! " !
This is a very illuminating thread.

[TotalInformation]

Thanks. I actually do think Sir Faul wrote most of the lyrics to the PAUL MCCARTNEY songs; the music, not so much. As to Elton John, he is the first candidate you have to look at for the piano-based ballads up until about 1973. Other research on the forum points to "Let It Be" as being largely lifted from an older piece, so there's some reason to look beyond Elton. "Long and Winding Road" is another that you have to suspect Elton for.

After mining Donovan and Mike Love in India and Yoko at Cavendish in the first half of 1968, Faul would have started to broaden his search for PAUL MCCARTNEY ghost-collaborators. Elton/Taupin were putting out records as early as 1965.

darkhorse said:

totalinformation said:

Maybe I'm Amazed's melody was clearly composed by Elton, but the lyrics are pretty clearly from written by Faul to Linda and pertain to their unique situation.

This rings true for me.


Regarding the writing of Faul's songs by other musicians, well nobody really knows for sure. That is why we are here. There's no use getting upset because someone is saying Faul didn't write his own songs. If it is possible that he is not the real Paul, then it is certainly possible that he didn't write some/all of his own songs.

[B]

I wouldn't rule out some Billy Joel input as well. I have no proof, but some of Billy Joel's songs hint at PID awareness. "Say Goodbye To Hollywood", and, as was pointed out at Revolution 9, "Piano Man".

[Jude]

In my honest opinion, if it was anyone else than this thread wouldn't exist. But Paul's replacement?
For whatever reason it seems unacceptable for the majority of people here that a talented songwriter could've replaced Paul. And those who hate his solo music try to justify their opinion of it by pointing out that he never wrote any of his "good" songs to begin with. But--again, just my opinion---it's truly horrible to suggest that on top of this man's difficulties in managing to live this lie for 40 years that some of his most famous songs, songs that he performs with a passion in front of live audiences, songs that were written during HIS tenure as Paul McCartney......aren't even his songs! And it's "well Billy Joel probably" and "Elton John definitely", but the fact of the matter that is being ignored here is that all these songs sound like they were written by the same man. And if you don't buy that, then compare George and John's Beatle work and to their later solo work and see if the standards of quality and of style still hold up after a decade or two of growing older.

[Mellow Yellow]

Well to be fair, I think John's quality slipped a bit after the Beatles, but George got alot better IMO

John never got back to a "Strawberry Fields Forever" level of quality (I hear glimmers of it in things like "Real Love), although Plastic Ono Band, Imagine, and Mind Games were all pretty good (especially Mind Games). After those I just don't like the sound.

[Jude]

melloyello said:

Well to be fair, I think John's quality slipped a bit after the Beatles, but George got alot better IMO

His first few albums, definitely. But I hear his quality slipped a lot later one and that "Gone Troppo" is one of the worst songs/albums ever written.

[B]

jude said:

In my honest opinion, if it was anyone else than this thread wouldn't exist. But Paul's replacement?
For whatever reason it seems unacceptable for the majority of people here that a talented songwriter could've replaced Paul. And those who hate his solo music try to justify their opinion of it by pointing out that he never wrote any of his "good" songs to begin with. But--again, just my opinion---it's truly horrible to suggest that on top of this man's difficulties in managing to live this lie for 40 years that some of his most famous songs, songs that he performs with a passion in front of live audiences, songs that were written during HIS tenure as Paul McCartney......aren't even his songs! And it's "well Billy Joel probably" and "Elton John definitely", but the fact of the matter that is being ignored here is that all these songs sound like they were written by the same man. And if you don't buy that, then compare George and John's Beatle work and to their later solo work and see if the standards of quality and of style still hold up after a decade or two of growing older.

Jude, I never said that Faul isn't an accomplished musician, or that he didn't write many of his
songs, but he may have had some help in the beginning.
Listen to "Smile Away" on the Ram album. The people singing in the background are saying:
"Show me how to do that. I don't know how to do that."
It's muffled, so as not to be noticeable, but it is there.
The Ram album is full of clues, imo, and I believe that the person who these words apply to are
Faul, learning how to "be" JPM.

[The Deceptionist]

jude said:

melloyello said:

Well to be fair, I think John's quality slipped a bit after the Beatles, but George got alot better IMO

His first few albums, definitely. But I hear his quality slipped a lot later one and that "Gone Troppo" is one of the worst songs/albums ever written.

I think 'Gone Troppo' was a bit of a throwaway album if I remember correctly; the final required album in a recording deal. He had a lot of troubles with his recording contract I think - as well as increased alienation following the punk era, so I guess it was his way of saying 'f@#k you' to the man

[B]

ben-fairhall.blogspot.com/2006/11/above-us-only-sky.html

Ben Fairhall - Battling the Behemoth
"Above Us Only Sky"

excerpts:

"Let us take, for example, Dr John Coleman: author of the highly-influential Conspirator's Hierarchy: The Committee of 300. He established the trend amongst conspiracy researchers who lean to the Right, of regarding the Beatles as products of a massive experiment in social engineering, devised by the Tavistock Institute of Human Relations and implemented by key agencies and personnel whom Tavistock (and the Committee to whom it reports) had safely in its pocket. This programme, according to Coleman and others, was planned well in advance and in response to societal trends which had risen above the radar of the social engineers....."

"It was as 'an integral part of 'The Aquarian Conspiracy' that the Beatles, according to Coleman, were first introduced to the world...."
"Vital to the success of the undertaking was..... the services of one Theodor Adorno, the influential German sociologist, philosopher and composer.
Having written 'academic papers in the 1940s and 50s on the addictiveness of popular music... (he has since) been transformed into a monster who advocated pop music as a form of extensive social control'. It is in this capacity, according to Coleman, that he composed all of the Beatles ouevre: the music and the lyrics - and performed the same function for several other famous British groups of the same period. A versatile guy, obviously."
-------------------------------------------

This is unlikely, to say the least, imo, but here's more information on Theodor Adorno. ("Teddy Boy"?)

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theodor_Adorno

"Theodor (or "Teddie") was born in Frankfurt..." Hmmm. I may have been right!

Relative to the Wiki article, This one has importance:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_Project

"The Radio Project was a social research project funded by the Rockefeller Foundation to look into the effects of mass media on society.

"In 1937, the Rockefeller Foundation started funding research to find the effects of new forms of mass media on society, especially radio. Several universities joined up and a headquarters was formed at the School of Public and International Affairs at Princeton University. The following people were involved:

Paul Lazarsfeld - Director of the Radio Project
Theodor Adorno - Chief of the Music Division
Hadley Cantril - A Princeton psychologist
Gordon Allport - another of Lazarsfeld's assistants, went on to be the Tavistock Institute's leading representative in the United States.
Frank Stanton - Researcher from CBS sent to help the project, went on to be president of CBS."

[B]

Here's more about Dr. John Coleman. This made me sit up and take notice.

educate-yourself.org/cn/johncolemancommof300order14mar05.shtml

Conspirators Hierarchy - The Committee of 300

By Dr. John Coleman

More infor at: coleman300.com

"Dr. John Coleman is a former intelligence agent of British MI6.
He rips the lid off the conspiratorial group which knows NO national boundaries, is ABOVE the law of ALL countries and controls every aspect of politics, commerce, religion, industry, banking, insurance, mining, and even the drug trade. Learn how this small elite group who are answerable to NO ONE, except its members, have pulled the strings on ALL major world events and why, until now, few people have even been aware of its existence, let alone power, in manipulating the affairs of the entire WORLD. All of these members are revealed, including all of the corporations, government agencies and various movements which "they" have developed and control to further their own aims for WORLD DOMINATION."

Coleman also wrote a book about the history of the Tavistock Institute:

educate-yourself.org/cn/tavistockarticlesindex04jun04.shtml

"The Tavistock Institute of Human Relations"
Dr. John Coleman
The Tavistock Institute is located in the City of London and at Sussex University in England

-------------------------------

On a totally unrelated note, - or maybe not - , there's this:

educate-yourself.org/mc/illumformula11chap.shtml

Just reading it is enough to make you crazy. It's not one of Coleman's works, however.

[bungalowbill]

Have you noticed how Paul McCartney or whoever you guys call him changed styles? Before 1966 he tended to sing nice soft ballads, afterwords he tended to write music hall numbers like "Honey Pie"

[Doc]

bungalowbill said:

Have you noticed how Paul McCartney or whoever you guys call him changed styles? Before 1966 he tended to sing nice soft ballads, afterwords he tended to write music hall numbers like "Honey Pie"

Yes, I thought that "Rinse the Raindrops" was totally a Broadway tune, and would have fit into the Producers.














Not really.