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Post by JoJo on May 17, 2004 17:05:25 GMT -5
This that close up of his eyes from the Strawberry Fields video. There's been a lot of discussion regarding the color but what about the fold where the eyelids meet the brow? In this frame, it looks unnatural, like plastic surgery scars. (?) Can't find one from on or before 1966 that matches this in closeness and detail. But that would be a very key thing to duplicate, that was a unique "Paul" feature, the way those lines tend to arch.
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joejoe
Hard Day's Night
Posts: 24
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Post by joejoe on Jul 15, 2004 21:14:02 GMT -5
That is an unhealed scar over the left eye! Where could it have come from except surgery? Any proposed alternatives from the skeptics? Good find JoJo.
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Post by JoJo on Jul 16, 2004 17:11:59 GMT -5
Thanks joejoe... It does look like a situation where the stitches just came out pretty recently. I could be wrong, but.. Oh and btw, I never meant to steal your screen name, I had already made a bunch of posts at the other board before I realized there was another variation of my name there. (I'm assuming you are the same one) Just thought I'd finally mention that..
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Post by matchbox on Jul 16, 2004 22:17:35 GMT -5
If you have the Anthology DVD, it is very clearly just a shadow created by the fold of skin. The pic above is of really poor quality compared to the DVD.
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Post by JoJo on Jul 16, 2004 23:42:41 GMT -5
If you have the Anthology DVD, it is very clearly just a shadow created by the fold of skin. The pic above is of really poor quality compared to the DVD. Here's the anthology version: Obviously the color is better, but yes unless the light is directly shining on a skin fold such as this, then the dark line we see is due to a shadow. A way of seeing the effect of this is to shine a flashlight on the palm of your hand, and then start to close your hand until the "lines" start to form. Shine the light at different angles, unless it's straight on, you will see a thin "shadow line". It does deliniate the line formed by the folds in the skin though, hope they got it right.. More stills here, when his eyes are wide open, in this case his right (our left) you don't see any scaring, so I was a little hasty perhaps. Hey it's a process of discovery, and no stone left unturned, right? Don't know why, but working with those last 3 pics, converting to jpg and resizing, it was really creepy... Ok, remember the definition of "hazel" vs "green" in that other post? Hazel: Green: Which one of the above does this one look like?
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joejoe
Hard Day's Night
Posts: 24
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Post by joejoe on Jul 18, 2004 21:28:46 GMT -5
[ Oh and btw, I never meant to steal your screen name, I had already made a bunch of posts at the other board before I realized there was another variation of my name there. (I'm assuming you are the same one) Just thought I'd finally mention that.. [/quote] Yes I came over from the other side. You are a true lady, and always welcome.
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Post by DarkHorse on Jul 18, 2004 22:21:59 GMT -5
Don't know why, but working with those last 3 pics, converting to jpg and resizing, it was really creepy... Ok, remember the definition of "hazel" vs "green" in that other post? Hazel: Green: Which one of the above does this one look like? Uh green!!!!! They look hazel when Faul is wearing his brown contacts. The reason you see the green in that Strawberry Fields pic is probably because colored contacts weren't advanced enough to hide the green totally. Take a pair of green eyes and mix them with brown contacts and you get the 'hazel' color. So what we have here, in my opinion, is the people in the Beatles organization, who are working hard to keep this going, have changed history by stating that JPM's eyes were hazel when they were really brown(if you don't believe me, watch the Paperback Writer and Rain videos along with the movie Help! and you will see JPM has brown eyes. John's were hazel). Excellent work Jojo.
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Post by JoJo on Jul 19, 2004 15:12:15 GMT -5
Whoah, to quote Jonna, back the truck up, LOL!! ;D ;D ;D I had to check to make sure I had one of these: under my name... yup still there.. I guess the spelling is confusing, but I've seen it before.
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Post by jonna on Jul 19, 2004 15:37:30 GMT -5
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Post by JoJo on Jul 19, 2004 17:03:07 GMT -5
Hehe yeah I knew you'd be laughing your a** off Jonna... ;D No big deal joejoe, we like to kid around too..
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Post by matchbox on Jul 20, 2004 13:27:23 GMT -5
They look hazel when Faul is wearing his brown contacts. The reason you see the green in that Strawberry Fields pic is probably because colored contacts weren't advanced enough to hide the green totally. Take a pair of green eyes and mix them with brown contacts and you get the 'hazel' color. In 1964, Teen Screen Life Story printed a magazine all about Paul. It contained interviews with Paul and the other Beatles on Paul. Paul says that his eyes are hazel.
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Post by DarkHorse on Jul 20, 2004 14:01:57 GMT -5
In 1964, Teen Screen Life Story printed a magazine all about Paul. It contained interviews with Paul and the other Beatles on Paul. Paul says that his eyes are hazel. I was aware of Paul calling his eyes hazel back then, believe it or not. He does not have what I would call true hazel eyes from everything I've seen, though. John does. Paul's eyes are lighter than George's which are dark brown, yes. (My friend tells everyone his eyes are hazel but his eyes are green!) How does one explain why Paul's eyes are green in many pics from 1967 to present?
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Post by matchbox on Jul 20, 2004 14:49:34 GMT -5
How does one explain why Paul's eyes are green in many pics from 1967 to present? I am no expert on the sublect, but I've seen tons of color photos of Macca from the '70's to current times (unfortunately there are very few good, clear color pics of Paul from the '60's) . Sometimes his eyes look greenish, sometimes blueish grey and sometimes they look brown, or dark anyways. I always assumed it was a combination of lighting and the way the photo was developed. For my whole life I had always heard that hazel eyes were like 'chameleon eyes' with the ability to look different colors at different times. Clear as mud? Anyhow. I wanted to post that quote of Paul (from a vintage source ) because I wasn't sure if everyone was aware that Paul had described his own eyes as hazel. As to what the word 'hazel' actually signifies, that is a whole other can of worms.
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Post by LarryC on Jul 20, 2004 15:44:17 GMT -5
I suppose I've always had the wrong idea about what hazel eyes really means as I have alway considered mine hazel because that's what my mother told me they were...haha. My eyes are more along the lines of the green example, however, but yet sometimes they will appear brown depending on light and whatever colors my shirt happens to be, and other times they appear more green or whatever. By definition, however, I think JoJo's example of the hazel eye conforms more to Webster's definition than do my own, or even Paul's...Webster refers to it being a light brown to a yellow-brown. And, maybe, Paul's idea of hazel has been like mine...who knows. I think the reason his eyes look so dark in the Sgt Pepper pics is because his pupils are dialated from some good orange sunshine or purple haze...hehe.
* * * added:
I'm sort of jumping into this discussion not fully understanding the initial point in question so I'll assume it is about that extra bit of flesh that seems to sag over his left eyelid (our right)? That's the side that his eyebrow was injured when he did a face plant on the pavement isn't it? I would think it would be safe to speculate a little bit and say that there could have been a certain amount of nerve damage in that area too which may, or may not, have caused some problems with minor involuntary facial muscle control which would normally keep that bit of flesh from sagging like that. I dunno, I'm not an expert either...and most of the people you hear about having plastic surgury on their eyelids is for drawing them up more tightly instead of making them sag. I would also think a skin graft would be in order to make something like this appear intentionally, and when has anyone ever seen a skin graft look so clean as this? With todays medicine maybe, but in the middle 60's I wouldn't think so...but then most skin grafts I've ever seen were for burn injuries. I just think the injury to his brow area could be responsible for something like this.
It would be interesting, though, to find a plastic surgeon and see what he/she might have to say about this.
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Post by JoJo on Jul 20, 2004 17:18:45 GMT -5
Well regarding definitions, ask your local eye practitioner I guess. Just a thought, but the English are a little more particular about word usage than we sloppy americans, even the working class, so when he said "hazel", it may have been with the full understanding that he meant light brown. (or yellowish brown, but not crossing over to a cool color like green) Indulge me in a little cut and pasting, and I'll give my thoughts on it, not cut paste and dump, like someone we used to know.. From: www.fi.edu/tfi/units/life/forums/anatomy/1126992543.htmlWhat's interesting is that the clarity of this Anthology still, (btw I notice no one called into question the source this time.. ) Shows an eye that has varying degrees of color as he mentioned. Some brown around the pupil, then a light green in the center, then around the outer edges, a darker green, almost blue. The lighting was outdoors I would assume, so in this case they would use a slower speed film, which tends to do color in richer tones, not grainy like high speed. This is an eye with some very unique features, you have to agree.
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Post by DarkHorse on Jul 20, 2004 19:05:45 GMT -5
The eyes in the Strawberry Fields video are definitely green! That's pretty obvious.
Another note, my eyes are blue, yet appear almost grey sometimes(there's even yellow in them if you look closely) therefore they change color but they are not hazel by any means.
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Post by lj on Jul 21, 2004 15:13:23 GMT -5
paul after 1966 has green eyes, for me there's no discussion there. BEFORE 1966, now that's a different story. as much as you have that quote from a "vintage" mag that says he has hazel eyes, i had one (somewhere i HAVE yet to find) where paul's eyes are described as "chocolate brown". that shows that nothing is reliable. no, nothing. we can't even trust our eyes, sometimes, so... that shows. anyway, i think pre 1966 paul's eyes were brown, maybe light brown, dark brown depending on the lighting, i don't know. my eyes are dark brown and they can look more or less dark or light depending on the lighting, but NEVER green (i wish LOL). my brother's eyes are greenish and sometimes they look hazel, sometimes they look completely green. ok, i missed the point...
anyway... i'm going to take the dust off some of the things i had on my website and post some pics here to show that those brown eyes paul had could never look green, imo.
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Post by matchbox on Jul 21, 2004 17:54:09 GMT -5
as much as you have that quote from a "vintage" mag that says he has hazel eyes, i had one (somewhere i HAVE yet to find) where paul's eyes are described as "chocolate brown". that shows that nothing is reliable. no, Not exactly. The quote I provided came directly from Paul. I remember seeing the "chocolate brown" descripion before, and I don't remember it coming from Paul. It would be cool if you could find it, because my recollection is that it was the writers description of Paul. Probably from looking at photographs.
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Post by JoJo on Jul 21, 2004 20:40:04 GMT -5
Are you sure you are talking about the same thing LJ is talking about? What I mean is, you have no way of knowing, without psychic powers, which article she is refering to. And if it's your theory that the author was refering to a photograph, "perhaps" would be better word usage than "probably".
There's not just one lone article out there that refers to his eye color, many random people met Paul in person, shook his hand gazed into his eyes. (the star struck fans) It wasn't necessary to look at a photograph, many people saw the genuine article and mentioned the eye color in passing anyway.
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Post by DarkHorse on Jul 21, 2004 20:46:37 GMT -5
Matchbox, have you even tried viewing the color movies and videos of Paul before 1967 or are you gonna go by what the magazines say?
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Post by eyesbleed on Jul 21, 2004 20:49:48 GMT -5
I know my "Help" dvd will be here any day now!
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Post by matchbox on Jul 21, 2004 22:23:08 GMT -5
JoJo. Yes you are right. 'Perhaps' would have been a better choice.
I said that it would be cool if the original could be found, and gave my opinion based on my previous recollection.
Dark Horse. The only thing I have is a DVD of Help. I scanned through to find some of the more well lighted scenes. Ringo's eyes are appear to be blue. Paul, John and George's eyes are all much darker. If I had to go by the DVD alone, I would say all three had brown eyes.
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Post by revolver on Aug 1, 2004 19:29:39 GMT -5
Here's the anthology version: For those who suggest there were multiple Fauls, note how this close-up looks very much like (IMO) the mid-to-late seventies Faul of Wings. He's the same guy. (Never could see any other way)
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Post by Morph on Sept 3, 2004 2:00:39 GMT -5
Excellent!
I don't believe that line on his left eye is a scar, nor an injury, it's Faul's natural fold, something he's been struggling with the whole time. And wasn't Paul already injured when Paperback/Rain videos were filmed? His tooth is chipped, and his face swollen, but his left eye looks nothing like this.
From what I've been noticing a lot lately:
Faul's lid fold, when his eyes are relaxed, starts from the outside and shoots straight over the eye towards the brow. Another less-prominent fold starts on the inside and almost intersects the first fold. But what really stands out is that the first fold goes past the endpoint of the second fold...it's kind of a "t" intersection. I've looked at several photos, and it's a recurring detail. Faul has a habit of raising his brow quite a bit, diminishing this effect.
The plastic surgeons managed to join these two folds, but it resulted in a relatively sharp angle and tons of wrinkling (70s and 80s era photos display this). Unfortunately, the original bypass fold has reappeared in recent times.
It's often a tough one get pictures of, especially in 67-68, given the strategic placement of shadow, but it's there.
Paul's lid fold is a continuous line across the entire eye, always has been.
I've compared this shot with the close-up eyes from FOTH...they look different...the left lid and the spacing look off. If that's Faul shouldn't the eyes be identical? I'm almost certain that's Paul, possibly outtake footage from Paperback/Rain videos that was spliced in...the greenish cast looks familiar.
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Post by FlamingPie on Sept 3, 2004 2:10:16 GMT -5
If that's Faul shouldn't the eyes be identical? I'm almost certain that's Paul, possibly outtake footage from Paperback/Rain videos that was spliced in...the greenish cast looks familiar. You can see the top of his moustache in that pic, so it's "Faul".
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