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Post by LOVELYRITA on Jan 27, 2006 19:51:39 GMT -5
Not that this has any significance with PID/PWR, but I thought I'd share this site which shows the cast of characters from the bomb of a movie. If you scroll down to the bottom there's a list of people who were in the group picture at the end, something of a who's who or who was.... I find it interesting that Peter Frampton played "Billy Shears". www.geocities.com/sgtpepper78/CastandCrew.htmlI had watched part of Frampton's Bio and he signed to do the movie because he thought Bill was part of the project. How ironic. But just for a sick flashback to a bomb that should have been good with that music....but wasn't..... Reminder that Robert Stigwood used to work for Brian Epstein. It's a small world after all.... |
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Post by LOVELYRITA on Jan 31, 2006 0:44:51 GMT -5
I noticed two names on the list that has a Beatle connection, in the group at the end, Keith Allison and Donovan.
Hmmmm were there secret Faul's in this crowd?
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Post by TotalInformation on Jan 31, 2006 0:48:37 GMT -5
Donovan could be he (faux PAUL) as they are all together...
Let's guess which "white album" MCCARTNEY song Donovan wrote....
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Post by LOVELYRITA on Jan 31, 2006 23:11:34 GMT -5
Hmmm, Martha My Dear or Honey Pie. That's my guess.
Not "Why Don't We Do It In the Road" or "Helter Skelter"......
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Post by beatlies on Jan 31, 2006 23:13:49 GMT -5
Hmmm, Martha My Dear or Honey Pie. That's my guess. Not "Why Don't We Do It In the Road" or "Helter Skelter"...... Correct, those weren't Donovan. Charles Manson wrote those. |
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Post by JoJo on Feb 1, 2006 19:04:29 GMT -5
Hmmm, Martha My Dear or Honey Pie. That's my guess. Not "Why Don't We Do It In the Road" or "Helter Skelter"...... Correct, those weren't Donovan. Charles Manson wrote those. Care to expand on that one? I did find some Manson "unplugged" stuff out there, for lack of a better word, and he was not without talent, strange as that may sound. The chatter between songs is creepy, I guess your mind sees it that way considering it's well...Charles Manson.. Even if I didn't know who he was, I would say this guy is pretty tightly wound, listening to him interact with the others. |
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Post by TotalInformation on Feb 3, 2006 1:08:48 GMT -5
I think RITA nailed "Martha, My Dear." If there's a Donovan/FAUL collaboration, that's it. "Honey Pie" I think it may have been an old JPM tune FAUL remade.
"Do It/Road" -- I would say Lennon/FAUL, and that it is a PID song. Fit in the original Doll's HOuse /PID concept.
"Helter Skelter" -- really hard to say. Maybe Richard Asher & FAUL. Probably evolved more in the studio, if the the Anthology track is any indication.
Manson probably heard EMI studio tapes from his MK handlers while it was in production.
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Post by plastic paul on Feb 3, 2006 6:26:32 GMT -5
Hmmm, Martha My Dear. That's my guess. Dammit! I was gonna say that, but bottled it in case you guys thoughts I is stoopid! ;D Good shout Rita! |
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Post by beatlies on Feb 3, 2006 10:04:40 GMT -5
I think RITA nailed "Martha, My Dear." If there's a Donovan/FAUL collaboration, that's it. "Honey Pie" I think it may have been an old JPM tune FAUL remade. "Do It/Road" -- I would say Lennon/FAUL, and that it is a PID song. Fit in the original Doll's HOuse /PID concept. "Helter Skelter" -- really hard to say. Maybe Richard Asher & FAUL. Probably evolved more in the studio, if the the Anthology track is any indication. Manson probably heard EMI studio tapes from his MK handlers while it was in production. The acoustic guitar, earlier version of Helter Skelter in the Anthology video has a soft, jazzy beach music Southern California relaxing feel to it, and Faul is singing falsetto like he is imitating the Beach Boys. The threatening, scary, disturbing, violently psychotically insane-sounding version on the white album has the sounds of seagulls or instruments imitating screaming seagulls. Comparing them, it's like a Beach Boys-Imposter Doris Day-Melcher-Manson transformation from something innocent and charming into something evil. Also, what is it Faul is half-singing, half-speaking after the singing verses? |
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Post by plastic paul on Feb 3, 2006 20:02:42 GMT -5
Ok yeah that's a fair call, but (and forgive me if i'm putting words into your mouth) are you saying that the beatles purposely made the white album version to push psychotic people like manson into commiting these appalling acts?
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Post by beatlies on Feb 4, 2006 0:52:46 GMT -5
Ok yeah that's a fair call, but (and forgive me if i'm putting words into your mouth) are you saying that the beatles purposely made the white album version to push psychotic people like manson into commiting these appalling acts? I'm thinking about a direct link from Manson to the Beatles and Faul in 1968 through Terry Melcher, but also it does sound quite a bit like Faul is asking for trouble by knowing the Beatles have such a young, large and in many cases obsessively devoted and fragile-minded-fanatic audience of fans and then releasing this unprecedentedly violent-sadistic psychotic, bizarre song. About Sheppard-Faul, found this unintentionally ironic and pathetic observation on a musicologist's website page analyzing Helter Skelter: "Fourth section ¡ª [3:42 - 3:58]: Slow fade in on what sounds like a straight continuation of what had just been faded out; comes back to full volume. Fifth section ¡ª [3:58 - 4:15]: Slow fade-out again after sustaining full volume for about 8 seconds; this time, we do not disappear completely. Sixth section ¡ª [4:15 - 4:29]: Slight rhythm change, then halt, then rapid fade-up for final drumbeats, noise, "blisters on my fingers" and the last guitar noise bouncing instantaneously from left to right. 3 Some Final Thoughts Macca's masquerade here reminds me of someone I went to high school with. This fellow liked to mimic and impersonate; friends, teachers, characters from movies and TV, even some very strange ones he made up all by himself.
He was almost too good at this sort of thing; often very amusing, but at other times a bit tiresome and unrelenting. Once in a while, in fact, he'd come up with someone or something that was just too strange and in pathetically bad taste, and for a moment you'd worry that maybe this time he'd gone insane and would not be able to ever snap out of it.
Anybody else out there go to school with this guy?
Regards,
Allan W. Pollack " Hey Allan, did you go to high school in Ontario, Canada, maybe your weird classmate it IS the same guy as the one you have been fooled into thinking is McCartney ... |
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Post by TotalInformation on Feb 4, 2006 2:26:09 GMT -5
Beatlies, what is necessary to fill out your theory is to ask the question - do we know if FAULguy personally visited L.A. in 1968? If so, when?
We know FAUL and Mal Evans visited the Beach Boys weeks before Pepper was released, driving Brian WIlson mad for 38 yrs.
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Post by TotalInformation on Feb 4, 2006 2:30:21 GMT -5
The acoustic version was recorded sometime in July and aired on Danish TV July 19. I don't think it was in the still-lost Kinfauns demos.Did FAUL go to California in June? Meet with Mike Love?
I would really like to hear that version...
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Post by JoJo on Feb 4, 2006 10:49:23 GMT -5
Don't forget the movie Seconds, which was also supposed to have driven him mad, and the similarity to the other story in which he became entangled.. What if someone offered you the chance to begin again, with a new life that was organized to be exactly what you wanted it to be? That's what the organization offers some wealthy people. They find a life that is what their clients would have wanted, artist, writer, politician, kill the person who is to be replaced and surgically alter their clients to take their places. We follow a new client from first contact, through his staged death, to surgery, recovery and replacement. Of course thats when things become complicated.In the Anthology Director's Cut, where GM, Neil and Derek are being interviewed for Dutch (?) TV, the interviewer asks George if one of the things he plans to release on the Anth. cd is the 45 minute (it's that long?) version of Helter Skelter. Martin quickly dismisses that, saying only Beatle fanatics would be interested. Either Derek or Neil mumbles to George, "it's out on bootleg.." Yes, there are a few minutes here and there of unplugged versions, but not this extra extra long version, it's the "holy grail" of Beatles boot collectors. |
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Post by beatlies on Feb 4, 2006 11:29:24 GMT -5
I was going to mention Seconds in a reply post to TotalInformation, about which there is a thread here, and the story that Wilson went crazy in the movie theater when an actor said "Good morning Mr. Wilson" to Terry Melcher-DORIS DAY-IMPOSTER co-star Rock Hudson's character, who is named Tony Wilson.
Did Faul and Mal Evans visit when this theater breakdown is said to have occured? We need a detailed timeline ...
Seconds was released in 1966 and is about people who get secret plastic surgery, something like the face tranplants they are starting to do now, and fake identities to become much younger and have a sceond chance in life ... the movie's director was John Frankenheimer who directed Frank "Fia" Sinatra and Angela-JPM-looking-Lansbury in the JFK assassination predicting movie The Manchurian Candidate (1962) and also The French Connection, in which Frankenheimer censored-omitted the facts of CIA creation and boosting of the heroin smuggling trade.
Do you think "only a Beatle fanatic would be interested" George Martin is nervous about some evidence of the truth leaking out on that long HS version?
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Post by JoJo on Feb 4, 2006 12:34:04 GMT -5
Supposedly a disk with the long version, although someone says "Beware - this one is a fake!" Emule users, could you try to find this? |
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Post by revolver on Feb 4, 2006 15:52:21 GMT -5
Don't forget the movie Seconds, which was also supposed to have driven him mad, and the similarity to the other story in which he became entangled.. What if someone offered you the chance to begin again, with a new life that was organized to be exactly what you wanted it to be? That's what the organization offers some wealthy people. They find a life that is what their clients would have wanted, artist, writer, politician, kill the person who is to be replaced and surgically alter their clients to take their places. We follow a new client from first contact, through his staged death, to surgery, recovery and replacement. Of course thats when things become complicated.In the Anthology Director's Cut, where GM, Neil and Derek are being interviewed for Dutch (?) TV, the interviewer asks George if one of the things he plans to release on the Anth. cd is the 45 minute (it's that long?) version of Helter Skelter. Martin quickly dismisses that, saying only Beatle fanatics would be interested. Either Derek or Neil mumbles to George, "it's out on bootleg.." Yes, there are a few minutes here and there of unplugged versions, but not this extra extra long version, it's the "holy grail" of Beatles boot collectors. Cool, it's available at Netflix. |
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Post by TotalInformation on Feb 4, 2006 16:54:10 GMT -5
This has already been covered -- "Seconds" does not fit the timeline as the catalyst for BW's madness. He flipped out and abandoned SMiLE 2 wks before completion during/subsequent to the visit of FAUL, Mal and the Pepper tapes in 67.
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Post by JoJo on Feb 4, 2006 17:59:33 GMT -5
Right, Seconds came out before the visits from the Sgt. and his entourage. However, would it be as interesting (or as telling) if it was reported that he flipped out over a John Wayne movie or something?
No, a movie about being REPLACED supposedly did this. A side step or two away from the truth..
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Post by LOVELYRITA on Feb 5, 2006 23:59:36 GMT -5
Something I had forgotten about, going back to the characters, Peter Frampton played Billy Shears, but Paul Nicholas played Bill's cousin Dougie Shears. I wonder if there was a "Dougie" somewhere in Bill's past?
The collection of oddities on the White Album, I had to go over in my mind what had that "Pop" feel that was Donovan-ish. Martha My Dear and Honey Pie sounded like the pop type of songs Donovan had made. Certainly the more sinister sounding material was not typical of Donovan's style. But after the India Experience we got Atlantis and Hurdy Gurdy Man.
"Atlantis"
The continent of Atlantis was an island which lay before the great flood in the area we now call the Atlantic Ocean.
So great an area of land, that from her western shores those beautiful sailors journeyed to the South and teh North Americas with ease, in their ships with painted sails.
TO the East Africa was a neighbour, across a short strait of sea miles.
The great Egyptian age is but a remnant of the Atlantian culture.
The antediluvian kings colonised the world.
All the Gods who play in the mythological dramas
In all legends from all lands were from fair Atlantis.
Knowing her fate, Atlantis sent out ships to all corners of the Earth.
On board were the Twelve:
The poet, the physician, the farmer, the scientist, the magician and the other so-called Gods of our legends.
Though Gods they were-
and as the elders of our time choose to remain blind
Let us rejoice and let us sing and dance and ring in the new Hail Atlantis!
Way down below the ocean where I eanna be she may be,
(repeated 4 more times)
My antediluvian baby, oh yeah yeah, yeah yeah yeah
.....this last part is continued....
...of this group of twelve...along with the poet, the physician, farmer, scientist, the magician....who were of the other "so called gods of our legends..."?
the walrus.....the fool....the dreamer.....the mountain boy....the prophet....the fireman and the joker......
Lyrics to Hurdy Gurdy Man
Thrown like a star in my vast sleep
I open my eyes to take a peep
To find that I was by the sea
Gazing with tranquility
Twas then when the Hurdy GUrdy Man
Came singing songs of love,
THen when the Hurday Gurdy man
Came singing songs of Love.
Hurdy gurdy, hurdy gurdy, hurdy gurdy, gurdy he sang.
(repeat three times)
Histories of shadows cast
Unenlightened shadows cast
Down through all eternity
The crying of humanity
Tis when the Hurdy Gurdy man
Comes singing songs of love,
Then when the Hurdy Gurdy man
Comes singing songs of love...
Then the hurdy gurdy, repeated....
Not sure what "Hurdy Gurdy" means...
but singing songs of love...
What were the early Beatles, the JPM era, songs about?
L-O-V-E
If I find out the meaning of hurdy gurdy....I'll share it later....
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Post by LOVELYRITA on Feb 6, 2006 9:27:08 GMT -5
hurdy gurdy is a 3 stringed instrument, and played by cranking it.
Hurdy gurdy man was usually depicted as an organ grinder.
What organ grinder ever sang songs of love? Usually they are depicted with a monkey on their back, symbolic for someone who has an addiction or a burden or obsession they cannot seem to overcome.
speaking of monkeys....I had to throw this in...Everybody's Got Something to Hide Except for Me and My Monkey.....
Bizarre symbolism?......or someone with an overactive imagination?....someone with too much time on their hands....
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